FOUND Friday

A weekly Google Hangout dedicated to discussing content marketing, search marketing, SEO and more.


Topic: Using content marketing strategies for onboarding and customer support

Steve Farnsworth, CMO the Steveology Group joins Found Friday to talk about using content marketing strategies and data to better support and move prospects and customers through their journey.

Erin O’Brien, President & COO at GinzaMetrics
Steve Farnsworth, CMO at The Steveology Group

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Erin: Hey, everybody. Welcome to this week’s edition of Get Found. I am joined this week by Steve Farnsworth. Today, we’re talking about using content marketing for onboarding and customer support. Steve, give us the reason you’re here and who you are.

Steve: I am Steve Farnsworth. I’m with the Steveology Group. We do content marketing for B2B companies to manage any content marketing. I’m here today because I know you and we talk some pretty good trash together.

Erin: That’s a true story. I’m Erin Robbins. I’m the President and COO of GinzaMetrics. I’m here because I like Steve and I’ve had just enough coffee to make it to this point in the day.

We talk a lot on this show about how contents going, a lot about how we can use content to deliver and generate more leads and what’s going on in the strategy world, with what’s going on. We talk about account-based marketing and a lot of things like that. I actually love to talk about some onboarding and customer support stuff specifically around account-based marketing with today’s topic. But what we want to talk about is right now, it seems like there’s a lot of this is content marketing and then this is customer support or this is onboarding or this is sales and there’s not maybe this idea that everything could be this seamless strategy.

I think that you and I were talking about account-based marketing as there’s no handoff. There is no baton. We all just stay involved. I think that that’s where some really good content marketing strategies for getting people the support they need, the onboarding they need can really be implemented with what’s going on in support.

Steve: Yes. Customer service has always been important. We’re talking about onboarding. We’re talking about bringing new customer on to certainly use product. This customer lifecycle has always been there but because of our interconnectedness, because of expectations, more companies are doing face-to-face with the customers, really, it all ties in together and marketing can’t just leave it at the door and say, “We brought you lead. We’re done,” and walk away.

I think that as a content marketer, there are these tools that we have. The onboarding of customer may not be your specific responsibility, you have these tools, you can take the sales and go, “We can do these things and work with them.” There’s so much we can do in terms of helping to lower customer service cost, to help increase customer experience to make it more positive and more seamless. We’ll talk about a couple of things you can do there, pretty easy ones that you can start implementing.

Erin: Yes. We definitely should because one of the things we hear all the time is marketing can get some ideas for content from support issues. But the thing that we’re not talking about is if you’re doing that, what you’re talking about is, “Okay, I got this idea from support for a topic but then I use that to generate a lead because it was a pain point. So, I generated a lead from it but then I just stopped.” There’s no real seamless flow of information from the time that the marketing says, “Hey, we can help you address that problem,” to then once you actually have to get onboarded with whatever it is being that needs to match. It all needs to actually be the thing.

You shouldn’t be like, marketing brought in this lead and the lead was talking about needing a [3:27 inaudible] particular problem. Then sales sells you on it and then you get handed off to some account management person who then has to onboard you. But does everybody know that that was your core issue? Do all those things answer the question in the way that you initially got interested?

Steve: Yes. Some of the tools that we have are just really adding rocket field to your onboarding process and your customer service process just really effective. Now, some of the things we’re going to talk about like, for instance, I love marketing automation software. I think you can do some really great things. I don’t think marketing automation is about automating marketing. It’s really about creating just in time information. Just in time information – getting things that people need at the right time.

When someone’s coming on board, they have some of that issues especially if you’re talking about a product that’s a little more complicated and there are some set of things they have to learn. The level you’re going to do this is going to depend on the complexity and the number of users that average customer has. But if you look at marketing automation software, then you can do these e-mail campaigns. You can set them up so that they go out at some kind of basic time.

We do that for marketing. Somebody does this and so they get these three e-mails on the schedule. We can use that same strategy for a new customer. A new customer comes on and if we’ve done our job as content marketer, we have a deep sense of what content are existing customer service, what they already have, what we can take and help make better with them or whatever the content we can help them create this process.

For instance, let’s say you have a collection of blog articles that are just really great about some of the issues that they’re going to face starting to use the new tool or whatever you sold them. You can set this out and say on day one, they get a little e-mail with maybe a link to a resource center like, “Here’s some of the things you can get. Here’s an article specifically for you.” Then maybe two days later, they get another one. It’s again something relevant to helping them on board, something to get used with the product.

I would say the first one should be really focusing on the questions they’re going to have at first starting use it, getting app training, kinds of information they need. You can have these things. There’s probably some hacks you have. These are great e-mails. You can have an opportunity to be in touch with these folks. All the people that are using your tool have some kind of basis, every couple days and then after a week or two, maybe it spaces every three or four days. You trail off so it’s less often and maybe they got the content.

But all the content you have you should look through what blogs we have, what resource do we already have in customer service that we could put into this automation software. Let’s figure out a strategy for sending that out and then welcome not [6:12 inaudible]. Simple e-mails just like, “Here’s something you can do,” simple, little, tasty, helpful. Couple of days later, “Here’s something you might want to do. Here’s a hack.”

If you really are smart, you’ll start making little explainer videos. With technology now, we’re doing this show, cover the cost of our expensive time, this is literally free. There are ways to create content for low cost. The explainer videos and having customer service involved, you can make a very powerful combination just going, stopping to think what are the challenges they’re going to have, what information helps them the most. These are the kinds of things you can find out from working with customer service and others sales engineers and that sort of thing.

It is an opportunity for marketing to really shine in a company. Obviously, you need to work directly with customer service and sales on all onboarding thing but it’s an opportunity for us to bring our tools and our wisdom to bear and actually help the overall customer service.

Not everybody is going to be a repeat customer because sometimes nature of the stuff. But a value of the customer is incredible. They’re more likely to buy from you again 80% or something like that. If you spent a couple of thousand dollars at one close deal, let’s say that’s for $100,000 deal or $50,000 or $10,000, whatever it was, you spent some amount of money and you want them to buy again or keep subscribing or to upgrade, you need to be thinking about: how am I going to bring value from marketing, from all the content we already have? How can we bring value?

Then what other things could we encourage customer service to help create? As marketers, can we go in there and help them create that content? If they need help with videos, maybe somebody in marketing knows how to put the videos together for them or edit them or make them easy to do or help do the setup or do the recording, all of those kinds of things.

Erin: I think that one of the things that maybe stops people from doing what we’re doing right now is that they think it has to be this really fancy thing. They feel like, “Oh my gosh, it’s not super polished.” I’m not saying you shouldn’t strive for polished. But we do this show regularly and I am in the middle of moving and I’m sitting on the floor of a rental in between moves but we’re still doing the show because the content is still the content. When somebody has a question and needs an answer to it, I don’t think that they care whether you’re sitting on a floor or not. I think they care about getting relevant topical information.

I think that one of the things you’re talking about is being able to tell people these things, you can add in this e-mails and these automations. This is actually where I feel like – I’m going to say it because I say it every week, I cannot help myself – this is where I think creating groups is such a big deal.

If you create content groups and keyword groups, this is one of the things we do in Ginza like you set up RegEx rules or pattern-matching rules for everything. Let’s say that somebody who’s going to come to use Ginza and I know that typically, we have in-house customers and agency customers and that they’re onboarded a little bit differently. I can put everything into those buckets.

Then I can put things like let’s say somebody really just wants to do a lot of competitor analysis and they’re really interested in tracking competitors. I can just create rules that say put all of my content into a bucket that has to do with competitor intelligence. Then essentially, what I have from that is just a list of everything. I can just take those things and as you mentioned, have them sent regularly. Then what you do is you start to look at how those people are actually using those things. If you want to get fancier with it, what are they clicking on in the e-mails, what types of competitor intelligence? Did they actually click on something that was more social-based? Did they want to know how to do international search things? Then you can take the things from that group and start weaving them in.

It depends on how much time you have. But really if you want to automate something and you’re not in a super big company, you can still do this stuff. You don’t have to do it with tons of money. You don’t have to do it with a team of 100 people. You can do it. You can start small and try it out and see how it goes.

But you’re right. This is a chance for marketing to shine because this is a really good opportunity for them to say, “Hey, you know what? You guys in support in account management already have so much stuff to have to deal with with inbound requests and information that we can actually help you maybe get ahead of the curve. We have all this content. We know what this person was interested in because we actually know what drove them to become a lead in the first place and we knew what their pain point was. We can actually feed them that information on an ongoing basis.”

Why wouldn’t you do it especially if you have the content?

Steve: Yes. I think to get started, to your point, it doesn’t have to be too complex. First of all, I think all marketers should be doing right along with sales as a regular thing. I know some CMOs that do it 15, 20 times a year. They go out with the guys. They don’t acknowledge it that they’re from marketing. They go and they’re part of the sales team. They know that shtick.

They bond tightly with a number of different sales folks. They learn what the problems are and they help go back and create marketing. They help to create velocity to leads already. You should already have that kind of relationship. You should be developing the same kind of relationship where they know you and you know them and you go have conversations, you go have lunch with the customer service.

These two groups you can create a working group, whoever you need, some of the content creators, marketing, sales or sales engineering, whatever the right thing is in customer service, you can go and you create this working group. It doesn’t have to be complex. But you can say, “We’re going to do this. Let’s start with the basic onboarding process of a series of e-mails. Here’s the kind of content we’ve done a little bit of audit. Let’s all recommend some stuff from this audit and then map that out.”

That’s not that complex if you’re working together. It’s something that’s a good place to start. But you said something I think as really you talked about tracking what’s getting used. I think that’s the real gold here. There’s a thing called the ETM code or tag. It’s basically a way to put a lot of information about a link into this ugly long thing and then use a Google shortener to make it nice and pretty. But when someone clicks on it or someone passes it around, your Google and links can pick up where that was used.

With onboarding stuff, you can use links for all that kind of stuff and understand who’s using what assets, what assets are being meaningful? Which ones are not being used? Is it just merely the topic itself or is it a bad headline that’s someone described the content or is it just not relevant? There’s a way to do that.

Tracking that kind of information is a good way to see to evolve this kind of program as opposed to doing it one and done you do it and come back. First time you do it is you’re tracking that every couple days, every week with the key folks. As time goes on, you can do it every month but you should come back and keep evolving that for four, five, six months until you have a really tight onboarding process and then the customer service can then keep that if that’s the right thing or somebody else can own it. But marketing should be involved in that process.

Just about the ETM codes, if you don’t know what that is, I encourage you folks to go out and learn. It’s not that complicated. It looks really scary but it’s not. You can do it in the tools for free, Google shortener and the ETM stuff, tag maker, all free stuff from Google.

Using that same tagging capability from content marketing, step it back to more in the sales enablement. You can actually tag content your providing sales for sales enablement and find out which pieces are being used. That way, same strategy. What’s really making a difference? What are the sales people going to? What do you need more of? What do you need less of?

Erin: This also goes back to people needing to know not just about is it a bad headline or is it the wrong content. A lot of times, what you’re going to find, especially if you tag or group content by type or not just by topic but by type of content. What I mean by type is like is it a video, is it a blog post, is it a case study? Is it a whitepaper? Is it a one pager? Whatever it is. Sometimes what you’re going to find is certain things people actually are like, “A video just works better,” but you won’t know whether or not somebody didn’t use the content because they were like, “I really wish somebody could have shown me how” as opposed to “I don’t want to try to read through this.”

Or what you might find is that for certain things, people are not able to watch videos and they’re on their phone or they’re doing something else and video content isn’t going to be going over very well. A lot of times, if you’re just looking at the content as a list of content and not looking at what type of content it is, you’re missing a lot of information about how your customer wants to consume certain types of onboarding or just general support stuff.

I’ll mention something because one, yes, learn about UTM stuff, ASAP, pronto, yesterday. There are two things I’ve noticed. One, I think it’s a great idea to get together with your sales and your marketing or your customer support. What we see a lot of now is distributed teams. Sales, marketing and support may not all be housed in the same building, in the same city or even in the same country. I think that unfortunately, that’s not an excuse to not do it. You and I are not in the same city or even the same states.

Steve: We’re in different states.

Erin: We’re in different states and we’re still hanging out.

Steve: Across the countries from each other.

Erin: Hanging out talking and you can get together and there’s no excuse to not make these things happen. You may not be able to do it over coffee but you still can. This is probably bourbon. But it actually says that on the cup. It says, “This is probably bourbon” on the cup. But you have no excuse to not make these interactions happen. I do think that some level of face-to-face is really important.

The other thing that I think is tough is one of the things I’ve noticed – and it may just be me but I don’t think it is because I’ve worked in a million different places and it’s like a universal thing – no matter how much support stuff you create and how many ways you try to proactively answer people’s questions, there’s some level of people will not read it. That happens. I’ve always thought it’s me, it’s me. I’m just not making cool enough explanations. No matter how much budget I ever had, it just like was a thing.

What I started to think over time was they’re not asking me how to do it. They’re asking me if I’ll just do it for them. This is like a little bit of a topic variance but how much do you think that organizations are responsible for actually just doing it for them versus really pushing back and saying, “I’m really sorry but, dude, you have to do this yourself at some point.”

Steve: Yes. That’s a tough one. I think that anytime you need somebody to do something, people only do what they are judged on. If you’re judged through your paycheck, if you’re judged on things… For instance, having the employees write blogs is normally a bad idea not because employees can’t write it. If they want to write it, that’s fine. But they tend not to do it because it’s the thing they do when they already finished all their other work and they get around to it if they get around to it.

That’s not going to change their paycheck. It’s not going to change their bonus. It’s not going to change their review. If you want something to be done, you need to make sure that’s incentivized in a way that’s meaningful. Otherwise, better to create a process that’s frictionless, as automated as possible, that people can do it with one and done or with a little training because people don’t have time to learn new things. Anything you can do to either make it where it’s something really part of their job, it’s that level of importance is good, or it’s something that it’s frictionless so they’re more encouraged to do it.

Erin: People don’t have time to learn new things I think is the saddest thing I’ve heard all week. Legitimately, I’m not trying to be snide. It’s the saddest thing I’ve heard. I think that it’s important for people to make time into somebody’s schedule, into somebody’s experience as an employee to learn new stuff because if your team members aren’t learning and growing, you’re doing everybody a disservice not just them but your organization too. Even if just selfishly you’re only thinking about your organization, your organization is suffering if people aren’t growing. Go ahead.

Steve: I’m just going to say this one thing. I think it’s really in this whole thing about if you end up creating content, one of the things I think is handy is there’s always an FAQ or common questions folks get. I think videos are really handy to have. You should have written versions also.

With the videos, one of the things that I think is a nice way to do is you can humanize a company by having different customer support people or onboarding folks do the little pieces. It doesn’t have to be one person or it doesn’t have to be that. But if you could get two or three or four folks to each do a couple, you have a nice spread of videos. They’re only a minute and a half, two minutes long. That’s all you want. You’re in and out.

Now, the customer is seeing the folks that they can go to if they have a problem resolved. That’s a nice way to humanize your company. Actually, there’s even a corporate narrative by allowing the customer service folks to provide this information directly through a little video thing.

Erin: Yes. I love video. Obviously, we do this. I like it just because it allows you to not just humanize but to really explain and show somebody something in a way that makes them feel like hey, somebody actually did do this. I’m not the only person that’s reading this and trying to figure it out because I think a lot of times when you read instructions on something especially if there’s a lot of steps, it starts to feel like you’re putting together IKEA furniture. You don’t want to feel that way especially when you’re really paying for something.

On my end of things, one of the things that I feel is there’s tiers depending on customer stuff. Obviously, we provide support and help and assistance to anybody that’s wanting to use the product at any point. But after a while, it’s like, “Hey, teach Amanda fish” kind of a situation.

One of the things that I’ve noticed with customer success and support and account is that there’s a difference between what I would consider to be technical support and softer support. Where that actually tends to be an issue in my experience is if I’m trying to make marketing content out of things that are coming from support and I’m trying to help them back, it helps me if they’ll categorize things.

What technical support people or what engineering folks will typically do is their version of a category for support is, “Was it a bug? What is it a feature request? Was it like this? Was it that?” But I’m like, “No.” That’s fine, you can definitely do that. On top of that, you need to know what kinds of things do people seem interested in or what part of the product are people most commonly asking questions about because where this actually loops back to is if there’s a specific area of something that people regularly have a question about, then that’s probably just an overall messaging issue or it’s actually a design issue like a UI problem.

Let’s say people just constantly call in even with something like a car. They’re like, “I can’t find where this one thing is in this car.” If support actually logs enough of those things that somebody can’t figure out how to do this thing in the car, next year, when they make the new model, they’ll probably change where that thing is.

Steve: Yes. A client just addressed that at the onboarding. I had a client who’s product marketing manager for the product. Once a month, he’ll do a webinar. It was a scheduled thing. He’d have this webinar, they wrote the script, really straightforward. It’s all his hacks. Hacks is probably not quite right. But it’s just like, “You’re getting started quick. Here are the things you want to do to cut through the BS.” He’d do this 45-minute thing, answer any kinds of questions and it was scheduled every month at a regular time.

What it would do is even though it’s the same thing, he would then save that. People sometimes like live things. They’re just drawn to it. Sometimes you can have zero people show up or 20 people show up. He would always just do it. It was that 45 minutes every month. When it was done, it was On Demand too.

People could go to the live one if they preferred that. A lot of people do. But three or four times, a number of people watch the On Demand one. It was fresh content. It was just the previous episode. He just kept updating it. Anytime, there’s new information, he’s updated the script. The next webinar they did, it was fresh. It’s a really nice way to connect directly with the customers. As a product marketing manager, he could actually see the kinds of questions they were asking too and help change the product as necessary and also help change the information you’re providing.

Erin: You touched on the idea that somebody does something regularly and people can join and do the live thing. I think one of the things the maybe trips people up is that a lot of people don’t like to do stuff live or don’t like to do things on camera because they’re unsure of how it’s going to turn out or they’re afraid that if it is live, they can’t go back and correct it and maybe they’ll seem foolish.

I think that a lot of that is one practice and it can only go so badly. Really, again, I’ve been doing this show for almost three years now, I guess, maybe a little longer. I can tell you almost everything that could have happened has happened at some point or another during the show. A bird flew into the window one time and cracked the window. Just so many weird things have happened.

Steve: Is that an omen of some kind?

Erin: Seriously, it scared the heck out of me. I didn’t know what happened. I tried to shut the camera down really quick. Yes. All kinds of different things have happened. I think also, there’s a level of preparedness and a familiarity and comfort with your topic level. I think that if you’re talking about how the customer service people or marketing folks make videos for certain things that you have to be really comfortable with your subject matter in order to do something like that because if you have to just read from a script and you don’t feel naturally knowledgeable about it, it’s never going to sound very convincing or very good. You can’t go off script at all in case something happens like you spilled coffee all over your script because I’ve done that too.

Steve: [24:50 inaudible]

Erin: Yes, fantastic. Yes, I’ve spilled things into the keyboard while doing the show. I think that there’s also some amount of you have to find what your vibe is. How much preparedness do you need? Do you need to write a script beforehand? Do you need bullet points? Do you actually just like to go completely off the cuff? But you have to find what that flow is and try to go with that. If you’re going to do something repeatedly especially.

Steve: One of the things that I think people forget about is many websites, in theory, are doing basic SEO. But a lot of times, that tends to be more than marketing content. I think there’s a huge argument to employee and SEO strategy with all your customer support and onboarding content.

What that would look like is making sure that you don’t put necessarily huge amounts of information in one place. You make sure that the pages that you create are easy to navigate, are really clear on that one subject, really use the H1s and H2s, have the right words that talk around the issue, all your metadata.

Having strong SEO compliance with your content and making sure that you itemize all those pieces so that in terms of subject matter, the same areas, helps make it more findable. It’s great for you to have a search thing in your website. But Google has an awesome search able to find that. If people are looking for answers about your product, you want to be in those results. It’s something that gets overlooked because it’s not considered necessary. We’re going to make sure that all the marketing stuff has got video SEO and we’ll work by the other stuff later.

Now, this really should be something. It should be fully in the house of within the SEO and good practices. That should just be start doing it for you. You don’t need to make a bunch of changes, you just need to start doing things going forward with a clearer SEO strategy.

Erin: That’s so true. I think that’s actually a really good topic potentially for next week or two weeks from now. There are so many good things that can come from being able to actually find the answers to questions and it’s not just from a marketing side. One of the things that we do and I get to say it again, groups, is that we try to group our content together around solutions to things or answers to stuff. We do it based on roles, based on feature type, based on topic, what kind of thing are you trying to do.

Then there are solution pages. It has different ways that people like to see things. For example, there are some blog posts there. There are some Slide Shares there. There are some videos there. There’s an overall explanation of what we do there. Those things are together but it gives people an option of how would you like to consume content to answer this question. That’s their own place to go. That’s support material but it leverages marketing content to answer the question and it’s SEOed.

The confusing part I think for a lot of folks is they feel like support stuff is support stuff and somebody else wrote that or support stuff was technical and it couldn’t be snazzy looking or whatever. It gets relegated to this place where everything just looks like a Word doc from the ‘90s and it’s really hideous.

I’ll tell you who’s really terrible about this, essentially everybody in the financial sector. I only know because I was recently trying to look for something on two different bank support areas. I can just tell you that all the support content was not only hideous and dry but almost unfindable. I Googled 20 different things trying to find stuff on their site. They’re like, “Oh, yes. We don’t really update those things necessarily frequently but you can always call and ask.” I was like, “I definitely don’t want to do that. I just want to look it up.”

Steve: Yes. When you provide this content, it has to be helpful and accessible. A lot of times, when you’re starting the onboarding process, you just stop and think about what elements or what characteristics do my most profitable, most important customers have and start there. How do you make those customers successful? By definition, everybody should end up being successful from that. But start with your cash cows. Those are the highest margin, highest growth potential customers.

The other thing is you need to make sure the process is not ad hoc, that the process is set in stone that when this thing happens, this person starts the process of getting this onboard content you’ve created. That needs to be a regular thing. You could actually even go further I think and there are a lot of places that provide certifications for learning their product.

If there’s a big kind of piece of training you want somebody to be super successful on, making it XYZ certification is a nice little thing. They’re now certified XYZ folks from your company by using your product. People like that stuff. It’s all that cautious creating the content which is a big deal but you already need to have that. All that cautious like maybe make a little thing you can send them in the mail like a little certificate that they can hang up in their office. These are really fairly easy things to do and actually get that kind of stuff out there.

Erin: It’s good branding for you that people want to say that they’re certified on your product. It’s good for them because people like to have stuff to put on their resumes. They really do. It’s really good opportunity for both ends to benefit from something like that.

I feel like I really like something when we had our account-based marketing conversation and we’re talking about there should not be a handoff, it should never feel like you’re being passed from marketing to sales to account management. You want it to be seamless.

I think that that is truly where people are missing the mark with this whole marketing customer success, account management, support, sales, everything is that we assume that our job stops at a certain point. The end of the day, it doesn’t ever stop because the idea is the customer is still the customer or the lead is going to become a customer. Or you’ve already been introduced to this person or to this organization. It’s everyone’s responsibility to bring them on board, make them successful, make them happy, make them an evangelist, make them grow, make them continue using the product or service, or whatever it is. That never stops. That’s not a job that you just hand off to somebody else. It’s always your job.

Even you want to go back to really traditional marketing roles, it doesn’t stop because it’s your job as a marketer to stay in touch with the customer to tell them what new things you have like what new features you’re working on, what new services you offer. It’s your job to keep them informed and to try to upsell them. It’s not somebody else’s job.

Steve: One of the things that people need to think about too and marketing can help with this is that the content that you choose to use for this kind of drift onboarding process in these tools that you’re going to give the customers, is you need to think about when people buy a drill, they’re buying drill, they need to drill hole. The content that you provide, not only we talked about how you could see which ones are being successful but the title, the information, that headline has to say what it’s about.

You can say this is about how to do XYZ with the such and such function. That’s not as helpful as saying, “We’re going to show you how to create faster customer support times by doing this with our product” or whatever. You need to say what the benefit is. What is it they’re going to get? They want to buy the hole, not the drill. If you want to really connect with the customers, make sure that you say, “This content is about learning this thing. You give us three minutes of your time or three minutes of your time, or whatever that is, and you’re going to learn this thing.” It has to have that kind of value. Marketing can really hold feet to fire.

Customer service folks are awesome. They can sometimes though get a little caught up in the technical stuff because that’s what they do. Marketing could come in here and say, “You know what? This is good. What can they do if they learn this? What’s going to help them? Let’s change the name of this or change this kind of stuff or let’s change the way it’s formatted because this is hard to read.” There are a lot of things that marketing can do to really help the customer lifecycle and improve that and create more revenue and more referrals.

Erin: Definitely. I know that we are overtime today. Last thoughts, I will say for customer, when you’re talking as a marketer or salesperson, whatever, the customer support and success, you have to remember they’re not hearing from people when somebody’s having a great time or a great day. They’re always hearing the problems. There are benefits and bad sides to that. The benefit is they know what common problems are and where people are being tripped up regularly, where people are unhappy regularly. They know trends. Probably, if you sat down and talk to them, if there’s not a tracking system already in place for them to notify and spot trends, they could probably just tell you because they hear that stuff daily.

But they’re never hearing from somebody when somebody’s having an amazing day. You have to also approach them with the understanding that they’re on the frontlines. They’re taking it pretty regularly from people who are in a hurry and frustrated already.

Steve: Yes. For some reason, if there’s internal politics or pushback, marketing should get involved with this. The reality is a bad onboarding process or unhappy customer or a product becomes shelfware because they can’t figure it out. This is a real issue. This is a brand issue.

If you do some surveys, you can find out that there are some group, a number of people are unhappy with the product, this is going to hurt your brand. That’s compelling reason for marketing to be proactive and helping these other units, these other organizations in their company become more aware of the trends, the communication tools that are available and how you can help.

Erin: Because it’s costs more money to replace the customer than it does to keep one.

Steve: A lot more.

Erin: On that note, we will conclude this week’s episode. We will see you guys back in a couple weeks. Until then, thanks for joining, Steve.

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